Talk Cancer

Question:

Hi Aramanth, I recall some weeks ago you posted that you had been diagnosed diabetic (T2 I assume?).  My commiserations. I’m beginning to wonder if that might be my problem too.  Who knows. Maybe I should go check it out.  Certainly I was well on the road to diabetes immediately before I discovered lc – so much so that I feared I was diabetic but was too scared to go to find out – and then I found lc & my blood sugars levelled out so beautifully, and practically all of my health problems sorted themselves out, so I heaved a sigh of relief and thought I had had a lucky escape. Well, eighteen pounds gained in four months is very bad news indeed.  I have *got* to get to the bottom of this, and find out what is happening, and why. How was diabetes diagnosed in you, if you don’t mind my asking?  You’ve been lc for years (as have I).  As far as I can tell, my blood sugar levels are perfectly stable… as you would expect from strict lc, yes/no?  Does a T2 diabetic still have peaks & troughs? I seem to recall that the glucose tolerance test is useless unless the subject has been eating high carb for some days beforehand.  For this reason alone, I always dismissed the idea of asking for one (I know exactly what eating high carb does to me, I’ve worked hard for years to reverse the damage, and there ain’t no way I’m going to put myself through that again).  Did you have it? It makes me wonder if you were diabetic before lc, or whether (more worryingly) you became diabetic while nevertheless eating lc?  I don’t understand how someone can become diabetic while eating lc, do you? So, then, what can be done if I am diabetic?   Very many thanks in advance, — Rosiebint

Response:

(posted and mailed) Hi Aramanth, I recall some weeks ago you posted that you had been diagnosed diabetic (T2 I assume?).  My commiserations.

Thanks, Rosie.  Yes, T2 is the diagnosis (as was my mother – it killed her at the ripe old age of 59).  It’s actually proving easier to handle than I’d thought. How was diabetes diagnosed in you, if you don’t mind my asking?  You’ve been lc for years (as have I).  As far as I can tell, my blood sugar levels are perfectly stable… as you would expect from strict lc, yes/no?  Does a T2 diabetic still have peaks & troughs?

Yes T2 still has peaks and troughs, if you don’t eat properly.  I started to get suspicious when I inherited Mum’s glucose meter and it showed consistently high readings.  So when I next saw my GP (I’m hypertensive and it never did respond to LC, so I have to see him regularly) I asked for a full blood panel since it had been a while since I’d last had one. That showed a fasting blood glucose of *11* (normal non-diabetic should be between 4.5 and 6.5).  So, no GTT (yay) just straight on to Metformin.  He is also pushing me to see the diabetes educators at the local hospital, which I’m resisting.  Since I already know (I have friends with T1 kids who have attended there in the past 2 years) that they push a high-carb, low-fat, lots-of-grains approach I refuse to put myself under the stress of dealing with them.  I have joined Diabetes Australia and I can get any additional information I need (such as foot and eye care, dealing with diabetes when ill, that kind of thing) from them as written information.  It also gives me access to reduced-cost supplies such as glucose meters, test strips, ketostix, etc. It makes me wonder if you were diabetic before lc, or whether (more worryingly) you became diabetic while nevertheless eating lc?  I don’t understand how someone can become diabetic while eating lc, do you?

I was VERY strongly pre-diabetic before I started LC.  I did have a GTT then and my GP told me I had at most 12 months before I became diabetic and more likely I would be over the line within 6 months. Going LC put it off more than 3 years, which is great!  I can only assume that my pancreas was already so worn out that it only took a minor stress to finish the job – and I have been under major stress this year.  I have lost 4 family members (including BIL to T1 and Mum to T2) and 3 friends (stroke, pancreatic cancer and T2).  Both kids have fought ongoing bouts of tonsillitis but never stepping ‘over the line’ to where I could get them taken out.  DH, I and my sister have all been in hospital for surgery (and I have more to come), and FIL is facing surgery for a leaky heart valve.  All in all, a pretty lousy year!  I know that (until Lee suggested I take L-glutamine) I did cheat somewhat this year which could have played a part.  I also ate a higher-carb (and lower fat) diet while recovering from my surgery since Insulin does play a role in healing of wounds and mine was *huge* (38cm hernia) and took a long time to heal. So, then, what can be done if I am diabetic?  

Get a glucose meter (if you don’t have one already) and TEST TEST TEST.  Yes, I know the test-strips can be expensive, but it’s worth it.  Test your blood glucose immediately on rising, before each meal and 2 hours after each meal (at the 1 hour mark as well, if you’re keen) for a couple of days.  That will give you a clear picture of what your blood glucose is doing.  If your fasting glucose is higher than about 8 or 9, see your GP and ask for a basic fasting blood test to be certain (since it might be meter technique at fault). If you *are* T2, continue eating LC – it’s best.  Get hold of a copy of Bernstein if you can and read it!  It’s very good (if technical, but you can handle technical reading) and will give you a good handle on things.  I’m finding Metformin very useful although the initial intestinal effects were uncomfortable.  Extra fibre helped there! Metformin has the effect of making your cells more sensitive to the insulin you’re producing.  Several people who were having trouble losing on LC (sound familiar?) have reported being able to lose when they add Metformin to the mix.  One friend of mine (doesn’t post here but I introduced her to LC and her doc suggested the Metformin) lost 20lb in her first year on LC alone and over a hundred in her second year when Metformin was added!  So far I’ve lost about 3kg (this after more than 2 years of stall or gain) but I’m not ‘counting’ it since it’s part of the regain. Exercise makes a HUGE difference.  30 mins of weight training makes a full 1mm/l difference in my blood glucose levels for the day, and *that* is significant.  At the moment 30 minutes (plus warm-up and cool down) is the best I can manage, along with a couple of short walks (taking kids to school) each day, but I hope to be able to improve that over time. So far, I haven’t been able to bring down my glucose levels to the point I want, although there is some noticeable improvement.  I’ll see my GP in the next few days and hopefully he’ll order a higher dose of Metformin (currently on 500mg twice daily) which should help.   Over all, I’m finding that management of T2 is somewhat simpler than I’d thought, although I think the fact that I was already LC has helped enormously.  Avoidance of simple sugars is automatic, the Sweet Treats are not nearly as tempting as my mother found them and my kids and DH are already in the habit of watching out for me, not eating Fun Stuff around me and so on.  Advice from other T2s here has also been invaluable! Best of luck! Aramanth

Response:

Thanks, Aramanth.  I’m still pretty clueless interpreting what these results mean, but as I say in another thread, I don’t yet know whether I’m non-diabetic, or a diabetic under control.  You are absolutely right that it doesn’t hurt to find out.  I have long suspected that some foods (eg chicken) spike my BS, and now I have a chance to find out.  Thanks for the suggestion to buy a monitor

No problem.  I had to wait for my Mum to die to get one <sigh.  I always intended to get one, but kept putting it off.  When she died, she had just replaced her monitor and my sisters told me it was best that I got it. If I’m not diabetic: very good news indeed.

The HbA1C would tend to indicate non-diabetic.  It’s basically a measure of your average blood sugar control over the previous 3 months.  According to my last one, under 6 is generally considered non-diabetic (or under EXCELLENT control).  My reading of 7.5 was considered excellent, but I’m aiming for under 7 next time. If I am diabetic: maybe that will explain why the buggering hell I’ve gained so much weight lately.

It could do.  There seem to be so many variables, and those of us with unusual metabolic responses often seem to be in the dark.  Pain, isn’t it? Aramanth

Response:

These readings look pretty good to me, Rosie.  It’s basically what I’m aiming for.  I’d say non-diabetic (and your HBA1C suggests that, too) but it doesn’t hurt to know what’s going on with your blood sugars, right?

Thanks, Aramanth.  I’m still pretty clueless interpreting what these results mean, but as I say in another thread, I don’t yet know whether I’m non-diabetic, or a diabetic under control.  You are absolutely right that it doesn’t hurt to find out.  I have long suspected that some foods (eg chicken) spike my BS, and now I have a chance to find out.  Thanks for the suggestion to buy a monitor If I’m not diabetic: very good news indeed. If I am diabetic: maybe that will explain why the buggering hell I’ve gained so much weight lately. — Rosiebint

Response:

These readings look pretty good to me, Rosie.  It’s basically what I’m aiming for.  I’d say non-diabetic (and your HBA1C suggests that, too) but it doesn’t hurt to know what’s going on with your blood sugars, right? Aramanth – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Further to yesterday’s results, this is what happened when I added a few carbs to this mix: On waking (fasting):    5.8 mmol/l *Immediately* after exercising on empty stomach (light but thorough workout, inc. 35 mins intense cardio):  5.6 Immediately before eating meal of lamb chops & brussels sprouts: 5.6 One hour post:          6.4 Two hours post:         4.6 The waking reading is surprisingly high, but still just within acceptable range (3.0 – 6.0 mmol/litre) – does this signify anything? One hour after the meal of lamb & sprouts, the reading is 6.4, which is out of range, but not greatly so.  Is this cause for concern?  What would a non-diabetic’s readings be likely to look like here? Two hours afterwards, the reading is 4.6, which looks like a significant drop to me.  Is this normal?  Pre lc, I used to get severe hypos two hours after eating; you could almost set your watch by it.  Here, there is still a BS drop two hours afterwards, although I didn’t feel hypo- ish.  So am I still getting a BS crash even eating lc, or is this what happens to everyone?

Response:

Further to yesterday’s results, this is what happened when I added a few carbs to this mix: On waking (fasting):    5.8 mmol/l *Immediately* after exercising on empty stomach (light but thorough workout, inc. 35 mins intense cardio):  5.6 Immediately before eating meal of lamb chops & brussels sprouts: 5.6 One hour post:          6.4 Two hours post:         4.6 The waking reading is surprisingly high, but still just within acceptable range (3.0 – 6.0 mmol/litre) – does this signify anything? One hour after the meal of lamb & sprouts, the reading is 6.4, which is out of range, but not greatly so.  Is this cause for concern?  What would a non-diabetic’s readings be likely to look like here? Two hours afterwards, the reading is 4.6, which looks like a significant drop to me.  Is this normal?  Pre lc, I used to get severe hypos two hours after eating; you could almost set your watch by it.  Here, there is still a BS drop two hours afterwards, although I didn’t feel hypo- ish.  So am I still getting a BS crash even eating lc, or is this what happens to everyone? — Rosiebint

Response:

Thanks so much for replying, Aramanth – and thanks for emailing it to me as well.  My ISP is distinctly dodgy at times, and I don’t trust it to propagate mail competently.  I’d hate to miss something as important as this. How was diabetes diagnosed in you, if you don’t mind my asking?  You’ve been lc for years (as have I).  As far as I can tell, my blood sugar levels are perfectly stable… as you would expect from strict lc, yes/no?  Does a T2 diabetic still have peaks & troughs? Yes T2 still has peaks and troughs, if you don’t eat properly.  I started to get suspicious when I inherited Mum’s glucose meter and it showed consistently high readings.  So when I next saw my GP (I’m hypertensive and it never did respond to LC, so I have to see him regularly) I asked for a full blood panel since it had been a while since I’d last had one.

I had a pretty comprehensive blood panel done in September.  The fasting glucose was 5.4 mmol/litre (standard range 3.0 – 6.0) which I thought was unhappily high given my strict lc-ness.  However, the HbA1c was 4.7% (with 6-7% defined as good, 7-8% defined as average & 9% defined as poor).  I imagine the HbA1c is a better indicator of BS levels, over time… what do you think? That showed a fasting blood glucose of *11* (normal non-diabetic should be between 4.5 and 6.5).  

Wow. So, no GTT (yay) just straight on to Metformin.  He is also pushing me to see the diabetes educators at the local hospital, which I’m resisting.  Since I already know (I have friends with T1 kids who have attended there in the past 2 years) that they push a high-carb, low-fat, lots-of-grains approach I refuse to put myself under the stress of dealing with them.  

Absolutely.  It’s the last thing you need. It makes me wonder if you were diabetic before lc, or whether (more worryingly) you became diabetic while nevertheless eating lc?  I don’t understand how someone can become diabetic while eating lc, do you? I was VERY strongly pre-diabetic before I started LC.  

Me too… I did have a GTT then and my GP told me I had at most 12 months before I became diabetic and more likely I would be over the line within 6 months. Going LC put it off more than 3 years, which is great!  I can only assume that my pancreas was already so worn out that it only took a minor stress to finish the job – and I have been under major stress this year.  I have lost 4 family members (including BIL to T1 and Mum to T2) and 3 friends (stroke, pancreatic cancer and T2).  Both kids have fought ongoing bouts of tonsillitis but never stepping ‘over the line’ to where I could get them taken out.  DH, I and my sister have all been in hospital for surgery (and I have more to come), and FIL is facing surgery for a leaky heart valve.  All in all, a pretty lousy year!  

Sympathies.  I’ve had the year from hell too – three major bereavements, my sister’s cancer, leaving my job.  In fact I wonder if that’s what’s going on here.  I can pinpoint exactly when this terrifying regain began.  It was at the beginning of August, at the end of the week where my employers were so vile to me (again) that I resigned.  I was in a right state then, and for some time afterwards.  I do wonder if the stress of that (and it was *awful*) pushed me over the edge into diabetes. I know that (until Lee suggested I take L-glutamine) I did cheat somewhat this year which could have played a part.  I also ate a higher-carb (and lower fat) diet while recovering from my surgery since Insulin does play a role in healing of wounds and mine was *huge* (38cm hernia) and took a long time to heal.

So it comes back to the adrenals after all.  No surprises there.  My investigations over the last few months lead me to believe that all disease is rooted in the adrenal hypothalamus-pituitary-adrenal axis, ie something is throwing off the way the adrenals respond to life’s stresses, hence disease. So, then, what can be done if I am diabetic?   Get a glucose meter (if you don’t have one already) and TEST TEST TEST.  Yes, I know the test-strips can be expensive, but it’s worth it.  Test your blood glucose immediately on rising, before each meal and 2 hours after each meal (at the 1 hour mark as well, if you’re keen) for a couple of days.  That will give you a clear picture of what your blood glucose is doing.  If your fasting glucose is higher than about 8 or 9, see your GP and ask for a basic fasting blood test to be certain (since it might be meter technique at fault).

Righto.  I dashed out yesterday & got a glucose meter for only