Talk Cancer

Question:

Instant contempt, I see. OK if that’s the attitude, oh sanctimonious one. I’ve made no claims for or against alternative medicine but the moment anyone speaks up for the right to express an opinion on any subject along comes a loudmouth such as yourself demanding examples.

You implied them.  You also whined about the posts here not conforming to your idea of what should be discussed on this NG.  You’re either a troll or very new to usenet. Are you afraid to let others make up their own minds?

Just terrified. There are three basic types of illness,

ROFLMAO. erf

Response:

I am in total agreement with you – the ability to hear of the experiences of others is valuable.  The ability to question is essential. The tired old dogma of "can you prove it to ME!!" is getting boring. Pennicillin works by treating like with like, vaccines work the same way.

Are you trying to look ignorant? So why is it that homoeopaths are mocked for advocating the same basic theory? Psychiatry works along the same lines as Hypnotherapy, by treating the way the mind perceives things.

You are so far off base with the above descriptions that it makes it pretty much impossible to communicate with you on a rational footing.  You, apparently, just make this stuff up to suit your own views and then write it down as if saying it will make it true.  You do not know what homeopathy claims to do or how it claims to work.  You do not understand how antibiotics work.  You do not have a clue about psychiatry.  Your above writings clearly reveal this.  I think a reasonable case can be made that you’re a classic troll.  It’s hard to imagine anyone who actually believes the crap you wrote above would deliberately make a fool of themselves by posting it here.  Then again, maybe not.  Do you also post on physics NGs and talk about how perpetual motion is similar to internal combustion?  How about extolling on a pregnancy NG that women don’t really suffer because babies actually come from storks? erf  But Hypnotists are called charlatans and Psychiatrists – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – make fortunes. Conventional medicine makes just as many mistakes as Alternative medicine. The graveyards are full of them from both sides! I hear that sound again , ding , ding ,ding , It’s as though someone’s brain is bouncing around again . The truth is that some folks do not have a life , and so they spend a lot of time attempting to confuse the issue . One way this is done is to ask repeatedly for proof or peer reviewed publications . They know that peer review { meaning MD stuff} won’t be found . These folks cannot seem to understand that a lot of people want alternative info , not the same old crap that we have been getting from the "peers" It is truly a shame that due to these folks fear and ignorance , alternative info is so hard to find . I think if they want to pray to the man-god in a white coat , that is very much their own karma. I think that to try to force their fear based crap on others is wrong . They do this with words here and money and votes elsewhere .  Ok , flame away ol fearful ones . Save us from free thought .   Tools This newsgroup is not sitting around the campfire singing "Kumbaya", it’s for discussion of alt therapies and what they are and whether they work.  Any claim made by anyone is subject to criticism.  If you don’t like it, go start your own newsgroup, calling it misc.health.alternative.sweetness.and.light.  The only posts allowed will be ones bragging about how great the alt therapies are and how all alt therapies are terrific, nothing wrong with any of ‘em. Not to mention how you too can make up to $100,000 a year selling these products from home!  Send e-mail for more information (the stuff we can’t say publicly, because the bashers would cite facts we can’t refute).   Of course, we don’t tell you until later that the whole business is selling distributor starter packs and motivational tapes on how to make big money.  Actually, we never tell you that, you have to figure it out for yourself (after you’ve spent big money on tapes and attending seminars).

Response:

Personal threats? How very adult. Not. And indicative of your mentality.

Yeah, except that I didn’t make any personal threats.  You need to work on your reading comprehension. Fire away, sunshine. I have a feeling that you are only shooting yourself in the foot.

That’s the problem with going just by feelings — they so often lead you astray. Genetic symptoms are NOT illnesses, they are conditions.

Sorry, I didn’t realize you were going to play word games.  I’m sorry you suffer from MD, not trying to goad you or anything, but you didn’t mention "conditions" in your earlier post. Irrespective of any Medical treatment they exist in the individual. Neither conventional or alternative medicine offers a cure.  And before you mouth off again I am speaking from PERSONAL experience of MD, a genetically transmitted condition. If your opinions can alter that you deserve canonising.

Not hardly.  But since I didn’t say they would, so what?  Also, you still haven’t said where cancer fits into your scheme of things. Conventional medicines denied (until recently) the benefits of cannabis as treatment to alleviate the effects of MS, MD and Parkinsons. Suddenly there is a move afoot to legalise this. Why? because conventional medicine admits mistakes. Unlike some posters on this news group.

I admitted a mistake within the last few days.  Sorry if you missed it.  Besides, I think conventional meds didn’t exactly deny the benefits of cannabis — the drug warriors just didn’t wanna hear it. How many kids treat nettle stings with dock leaf juice? basic homoeopathy, treating like with like…..is this wrong? I know it’s a simple example, I’m not a homoeopath!

Conventional homeopathic theory makes no sense whatever to me.  That has nothing to do with dock leaf juice, unless you’re diluting it to 1 part in a trillion trillion trillion. And hypnotism has helped many to overcome phobias, addictions and inadequacies. Is this wrong? Or is hypnotism suddenly a recognised medical practice?

I believe it’s recognized, yes.  So what’s the problem? Like I said. Grow up and realise that there is more to life than knocking others. Look, evaluate and consider before you condemn. But when you know you are right, go in with all guns blazing!

Thanks, but I already do that.  You were just assuming I didn’t.   — David Wright :: wright at ibnets.com :: Not a Spokesman for Anyone      These are my opinions only, but they’re almost always correct.              The Millennium actually begins on January 1, 2001                 So Get Ready for a Second Round of Parties

Response:

New thread…. MDs: Purveyors of GRISLY alt.med therapies – OBVIOUSLY ILLEGAL alt.med therapies… http://www.remarq.com/read/14325/q_-rBVy29AfYAAAAA PhD cheerleaders for MDs (eg. Dr. Wright) brag about how great are their favorite purveyors of alt.med therapies (MDs) – all the while CONCEALING/not acknowledging the FACT that MDs are the most prolific purveyors of alt.med therapies – GRISLY alt.med therapies – OBVIOUSLY ILLEGAL alt.med therapies… <<<<I read the name of this group as misc.health.alternative

ALTERNATIVE, right? and MISC standing for miscellaneous? So why all the flame posts and damning of the alternative medicines and therapies?<<<< David Wright, PhD replied: <<<<I guess it’s been long enough that this silly question

was due to be raised again…<<<< Todd D. Gastaldo, DC remarks: The "silly question" to be asked is, Why do non-MD alt.meds let MDs and their PhD cheerleaders (eg. Dr. Wright) get away with perpetuating the FALSE notion that most MD behaviors are not alt.med – criminally so? See *MOST* MD behaviors are "alt.med"/unproven (criminally so) – numerically speaking Dr. Wright continues… <<<<This newsgroup is not sitting around the campfire

singing "Kumbaya",…<<<< LOL!  In a sense, MDs and their PhD cheerleaders *DO* sit on this newsgroup singing "Kumbaya" – and they sing it REAL LOUD – to distract people from the FACT that they LIE and CENSOR – mothers and babies be damned! For the rest of this post, see… New thread…. MDs: Purveyors of GRISLY alt.med therapies – OBVIOUSLY ILLEGAL alt.med therapies… http://www.remarq.com/read/14325/q_-rBVy29AfYAAAAA Got questions?  Get answers over the phone at Keen.com. Up to 100 minutes free! http://www.keen.com

Response:

Milbank Quarterly publisher Dr. Dan Fox (Aaron’s dad?) pretends that exposure of obvious MD lies, an end to obvious MD-inflicted mass human suffering and instantly saving millions and billions per year – are not relevant to American health policy. Sigh… <<<<[Tinkersomeone, y]ou, apparently, just make this stuff

up to suit your own views and then write it down as if saying it will make it true.<<<< http://www.remarq.com/read/14325/qAxB3A1mF_hIC_EO7#LR Todd D. Gastaldo, DC remarks: LOL!  Reminds me of when Logician Happy Dog indicated to everyone that Aaron issued a "definitive rebuttal" of my claims – without ever reading my posts… See Happy Doggone "Logic" (also: My reply to Bowditch) Hey Happy Dog!  Aaron recently further abused his cultural authority as a university academic – falsely indicating that I misconstrued Gardosi et al.’s 1989 Lancet "randomised controlled trial of squatting" – where nobody squatted… See ‘Skeptic’ Aaron ’stalks’ himself/’Skeptic’ Aaron WELL connected (Milbank Memorial Fund) And (as noted above) Milbank Quarterly publisher Dr. Dan Fox (Aaron’s dad?) pretends that these matters – including exposure of obvious MD lies, an end to obvious MD-inflicted mass human suffering and instantly saving millions and billions per year – are not relevant to American health policy. See Urgent matter/Milbank Pres. Dr. Dan Fox… Sigh… Todd D. Gastaldo, D.C. 8948 SW Barbur Blvd Box 6 Portland, OR 97219 FAX (815) 366-2814 TEL (503) 640-0456 http://www.egroups.com/group/chiro-list Got questions?  Get answers over the phone at Keen.com. Up to 100 minutes free! http://www.keen.com

Response:

I am in total agreement with you – the ability to hear of the experiences of others is valuable.  The ability to question is essential. The tired old dogma of "can you prove it to ME!!" is getting boring. Pennicillin works by treating like with like, vaccines work the same way. So why is it that homoeopaths are mocked for advocating the same basic theory? Psychiatry works along the same lines as Hypnotherapy, by treating the way the mind perceives things. But Hypnotists are called charlatans and Psychiatrists make fortunes. Conventional medicine makes just as many mistakes as Alternative medicine. The graveyards are full of them from both sides!

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I hear that sound again , ding , ding ,ding , It’s as though someone’s brain is bouncing around again . The truth is that some folks do not have a life , and so they spend a lot of time attempting to confuse the issue . One way this is done is to ask repeatedly for proof or peer reviewed publications . They know that peer review { meaning MD stuff} won’t be found . These folks cannot seem to understand that a lot of people want alternative info , not the same old crap that we have been getting from the "peers" It is truly a shame that due to these folks fear and ignorance , alternative info is so hard to find . I think if they want to pray to the man-god in a white coat , that is very much their own karma. I think that to try to force their fear based crap on others is wrong . They do this with words here and money and votes elsewhere .  Ok , flame away ol fearful ones . Save us from free thought .   Tools This newsgroup is not sitting around the campfire singing "Kumbaya", it’s for discussion of alt therapies and what they are and whether they work.  Any claim made by anyone is subject to criticism.  If you don’t like it, go start your own newsgroup, calling it misc.health.alternative.sweetness.and.light.  The only posts allowed will be ones bragging about how great the alt therapies are and how all alt therapies are terrific, nothing wrong with any of ‘em. Not to mention how you too can make up to $100,000 a year selling these products from home!  Send e-mail for more information (the stuff we can’t say publicly, because the bashers would cite facts we can’t refute).   Of course, we don’t tell you until later that the whole business is selling distributor starter packs and motivational tapes on how to make big money.  Actually, we never tell you that, you have to figure it out for yourself (after you’ve spent big money on tapes and attending seminars).

Response:

Okay, what’s YOUR sales pitch? Because I sure as hell am not selling anything. But I AM interested in hearing of treatments to make life easier. Fortunately I have a very healthy sense of disbelief in the claims of snake oil salesmen!

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – This newsgroup is not sitting around the campfire singing "Kumbaya", it’s for discussion of alt therapies and what they are and whether they work.  Any claim made by anyone is subject to criticism.  If you don’t like it, go start your own newsgroup, calling it misc.health.alternative.sweetness.and.light.  The only posts allowed will be ones bragging about how great the alt therapies are and how all alt therapies are terrific, nothing wrong with any of ‘em. Not to mention how you too can make up to $100,000 a year selling these products from home!  Send e-mail for more information (the stuff we can’t say publicly, because the bashers would cite facts we can’t refute).   Of course, we don’t tell you until later that the whole business is selling distributor starter packs and motivational tapes on how to make big money.  Actually, we never tell you that, you have to figure it out for yourself (after you’ve spent big money on tapes and attending seminars).

Response:

I hear that sound again , ding , ding ,ding , It’s as though someone’s brain is bouncing around again . The truth is that some folks do not have a life , and so they spend a lot of time attempting to confuse the issue . One way this is done is to ask repeatedly for proof or peer reviewed publications . They know that peer review { meaning MD stuff} won’t be found . These folks cannot seem to understand that a lot of people want alternative info , not the same old crap that we have been getting from the "peers" It is truly a shame that due to these folks fear and ignorance , alternative info is so hard to find . I think if they want to pray to the man-god in a white coat , that is very much their own karma. I think that to try to force their fear based crap on others is wrong . They do this with words here and money and votes elsewhere .  Ok , flame away ol fearful ones . Save us from free thought .   Tools

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – This newsgroup is not sitting around the campfire singing "Kumbaya", it’s for discussion of alt therapies and what they are and whether they work.  Any claim made by anyone is subject to criticism.  If you don’t like it, go start your own newsgroup, calling it misc.health.alternative.sweetness.and.light.  The only posts allowed will be ones bragging about how great the alt therapies are and how all alt therapies are terrific, nothing wrong with any of ‘em. Not to mention how you too can make up to $100,000 a year selling these products from home!  Send e-mail for more information (the stuff we can’t say publicly, because the bashers would cite facts we can’t refute).   Of course, we don’t tell you until later that the whole business is selling distributor starter packs and motivational tapes on how to make big money.  Actually, we never tell you that, you have to figure it out for yourself (after you’ve spent big money on tapes and attending seminars).

Response:

Personal threats? How very adult. Not. And indicative of your mentality. Fire away, sunshine. I have a feeling that you are only shooting yourself in the foot. Genetic symptoms are NOT illnesses, they are conditions. Irrespective of any Medical treatment they exist in the individual. Neither conventional or alternative medicine offers a cure.  And before you mouth off again I am speaking from PERSONAL experience of MD, a genetically transmitted condition. If your opinions can alter that you deserve canonising. Conventional medicines denied (until recently) the benefits of cannabis as treatment to alleviate the effects of MS, MD and Parkinsons. Suddenly there is a move afoot to legalise this. Why? because conventional medicine admits mistakes. Unlike some posters on this news group. How many kids treat nettle stings with dock leaf juice? basic homoeopathy, treating like with like…..is this wrong? I know it’s a simple example, I’m not a homoeopath! And hypnotism has helped many to overcome phobias, addictions and inadequacies. Is this wrong? Or is hypnotism suddenly a recognised medical practice? Like I said. Grow up and realise that there is more to life than knocking others. Look, evaluate and consider before you condemn. But when you know you are right, go in with all guns blazing! Your turn!

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Instant contempt, I see. OK if that’s the attitude, oh sanctimonious one. I can broaden my field of fire to include you, if you want. I’ve made no claims for or against alternative medicine but the moment anyone speaks up for the right to express an opinion on any subject along comes a loudmouth such as yourself demanding examples. Gee, we’ve got our nerve, haven’t we?  We refuse to just sit there, accepting any sort of unfounded, vacuum-skulled criticism that comes along.  Instead, we get all huffy and ask for examples.  Usually, none are forthcoming.  How strange. Are you afraid to let others make up their own minds? I can’t stop them from making up their own minds.  I can, however, object to stupidity, vacuous analogies, bogus readings of the data, loaded statistics, unverifiable anecdotes, and other common weapons from the pro-alt arsenal.  And I do.  If you have a problem with that, too bad for you.  Go ahead and explain why. [Let me say firmly, and for the record, that there are many solid pro-alt posters who do not indulge in such tactics, and there are pro-conventional posters who do.  Just so nobody accuses me of tarring entire groups with the same brush.] There are three basic types of illness, Physical injury such as cuts, bruises and broken bones, illness caused by the introduction of a foreign body such as a poison, toxin or virus and illness that is due solely to the imagination. Where would you put non-pathogenically-induced cancer in that list? (I’m not being argumentative here, but it doesn’t seem to fit in any of the categories you listed.  Type I diabetes, neither, not to mention genetic conditions like Huntington’s chorea.) The correct use of any treatment depends on correctly identifying the cause and treating that. Ask your own GP how an aspirin works and for what purpose it should be administered. You may be surprised at how different the answer is to the one you expect. And I may not.  You don’t know what I know. Ask a hypnotist how his treatment works and you will get a very positive answer. But I wouldn’t see a hypnotist for treatment to a broken leg. For pity’s sake grow up. That last sentence is usually issued by people who need to take their own advice. Have a nice day,   — David Wright :: wright at ibnets.com :: Not a Spokesman for Anyone      These are my opinions only, but they’re almost always correct.              The Millennium actually begins on January 1, 2001                 So Get Ready for a Second Round of Parties

Response:

Instant contempt, I see. OK if that’s the attitude, oh sanctimonious one.

I can broaden my field of fire to include you, if you want. I’ve made no claims for or against alternative medicine but the moment anyone speaks up for the right to express an opinion on any subject along comes a loudmouth such as yourself demanding examples.

Gee, we’ve got our nerve, haven’t we?  We refuse to just sit there, accepting any sort of unfounded, vacuum-skulled criticism that comes along.  Instead, we get all huffy and ask for examples.  Usually, none are forthcoming.  How strange. Are you afraid to let others make up their own minds?

I can’t stop them from making up their own minds.  I can, however, object to stupidity, vacuous analogies, bogus readings of the data, loaded statistics, unverifiable anecdotes, and other common weapons from the pro-alt arsenal.  And I do.  If you have a problem with that, too bad for you.  Go ahead and explain why. [Let me say firmly, and for the record, that there are many solid pro-alt posters who do not indulge in such tactics, and there are pro-conventional posters who do.  Just so nobody accuses me of tarring entire groups with the same brush.] There are three basic types of illness, Physical injury such as cuts, bruises and broken bones, illness caused by the introduction of a foreign body such as a poison, toxin or virus and illness that is due solely to the imagination.

Where would you put non-pathogenically-induced cancer in that list? (I’m not being argumentative here, but it doesn’t seem to fit in any of the categories you listed.  Type I diabetes, neither, not to mention genetic conditions like Huntington’s chorea.) The correct use of any treatment depends on correctly identifying the cause and treating that. Ask your own GP how an aspirin works and for what purpose it should be administered. You may be surprised at how different the answer is to the one you expect.

And I may not.  You don’t know what I know. Ask a hypnotist how his treatment works and you will get a very positive answer. But I wouldn’t see a hypnotist for treatment to a broken leg. For pity’s sake grow up.

That last sentence is usually issued by people who need to take their own advice. Have a nice day,   — David Wright :: wright at ibnets.com :: Not a Spokesman for Anyone      These are my opinions only, but they’re almost always correct.              The Millennium actually begins on January 1, 2001                 So Get Ready for a Second Round of Parties

Response:

This newsgroup is not sitting around the campfire singing "Kumbaya", it’s for discussion of alt therapies and what they are and whether they work.  Any claim made by anyone is subject to criticism.  If you don’t like it, go start your own newsgroup, calling it misc.health.alternative.sweetness.and.light.  The only posts allowed will be ones bragging about how great the alt therapies are and how all alt therapies are terrific, nothing wrong with any of ‘em.

Not to mention how you too can make up to $100,000 a year selling these products from home!  Send e-mail for more information (the stuff we can’t say publicly, because the bashers would cite facts we can’t refute).   Of course, we don’t tell you until later that the whole business is selling distributor starter packs and motivational tapes on how to make big money.  Actually, we never tell you that, you have to figure it out for yourself (after you’ve spent big money on tapes and attending seminars).

Response:

Instant contempt, I see. OK if that’s the attitude, oh sanctimonious one. I’ve made no claims for or against alternative medicine but the moment anyone speaks up for the right to express an opinion on any subject along comes a loudmouth such as yourself demanding examples. Are you afraid to let others make up their own minds? There are three basic types of illness, Physical injury such as cuts, bruises and broken bones, illness caused by the introduction of a foreign body such as a poison, toxin or virus and illness that is due solely to the imagination. The correct use of any treatment depends on correctly identifying the cause and treating that. Ask your own GP how an aspirin works and for what purpose it should be administered. You may be surprised at how different the answer is to the one you expect. Ask a hypnotist how his treatment works and you will get a very positive answer. But I wouldn’t see a hypnotist for treatment to a broken leg. For pity’s sake grow up.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I read the name of this group as misc.health.alternative ALTERNATIVE, right? and MISC standing for miscellaneous? So why all the flame posts and damning of the alternative medicines and therapies? I guess it’s been long enough that this silly question was due to be raised again. This newsgroup is not sitting around the campfire singing "Kumbaya", it’s for discussion of alt therapies and what they are and whether they work.  Any claim made by anyone is subject to criticism.  If you don’t like it, go start your own newsgroup, calling it misc.health.alternative.sweetness.and.light.  The only posts allowed will be ones bragging about how great the alt therapies are and how all alt therapies are terrific, nothing wrong with any of ‘em. And why do so many people demand proofs that GP’s couldn’t give for conventional medicines? There are some strange values out there. Got any examples?  Let’s hear ‘em.   — David Wright :: wright at ibnets.com :: Not a Spokesman for Anyone      These are my opinions only, but they’re almost always correct.              The Millennium actually begins on January 1, 2001                 So Get Ready for a Second Round of Parties

Response:

I read the name of this group as misc.health.alternative ALTERNATIVE, right? and MISC standing for miscellaneous? So why all the flame posts and damning of the alternative medicines and therapies? And why do so many people demand proofs that GP’s couldn’t give for conventional medicines? There are some strange values out there.

Response:

I read the name of this group as misc.health.alternative ALTERNATIVE, right? and MISC standing for miscellaneous? So why all the flame posts and damning of the alternative medicines and therapies?

I guess it’s been long enough that this silly question was due to be raised again. This newsgroup is not sitting around the campfire singing "Kumbaya", it’s for discussion of alt therapies and what they are and whether they work.  Any claim made by anyone is subject to criticism.  If you don’t like it, go start your own newsgroup, calling it misc.health.alternative.sweetness.and.light.  The only posts allowed will be ones bragging about how great the alt therapies are and how all alt therapies are terrific, nothing wrong with any of ‘em. And why do so many people demand proofs that GP’s couldn’t give for conventional medicines? There are some strange values out there.

Got any examples?  Let’s hear ‘em.   — David Wright :: wright at ibnets.com :: Not a Spokesman for Anyone      These are my opinions only, but they’re almost always correct.              The Millennium actually begins on January 1, 2001                 So Get Ready for a Second Round of Parties

Response: