Talk Cancer

Question:

Now that I’ve seen what some of my relatives have gone through and how the various drugs affected them, when I see old sick people now I see the effects of drugs they are being induced to take more than old age. It’s very interesting the reverence that someone like "steph" in this newsgroup is held in by users of this group, even though (s)he is an obvious narrow minded bigot and incredibly rude and insulting to anyone who challenges the "orthodoxy" – in other words a fairly typical doctor.

I challenge "orthodoxy" every day, like many doctors. BTW, I’m credibly rude, not incredibly rude.

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Now that I’ve seen what some of my relatives have gone through and how the various drugs affected them, when I see old sick people now I see the effects of drugs they are being induced to take more than old age. It’s very interesting the reverence that someone like "steph" in this newsgroup is held in by users of this group, even though (s)he is an obvious narrow minded bigot and incredibly rude and insulting to anyone who challenges the "orthodoxy" – in other words a fairly typical doctor. I challenge "orthodoxy" every day, like many doctors. BTW, I’m credibly rude, not incredibly rude.

I didn’t think jBS remark deserved a reply. What is he doing in the NG .He could be famous saving people and selling cures.(eye of newt,etc.)

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Great to see someone else who is wise to the medical "industry". Both of my parents were also killed by medical incompetence and corruption. RE coral calcium I saw some of that infomercial also, I think the claims are probably exaggerated (though not necessarily) but there is probably quite a bit of validity in them – I don’t know that you have to take that form of calcium, probably a good chelated calcium/magnesium combo would be as good. I’d say almost for sure Barefoot is in it for big bucks but that doesn’t mean he is a liar, once again not many doctors are working for the warm fuzzy feeling of helping people. Now that I’ve seen what some of my relatives have gone through and how the various drugs affected them, when I see old sick people now I see the effects of drugs they are being induced to take more than old age. It’s very interesting the reverence that someone like "steph" in this newsgroup is held in by users of this group, even though (s)he is an obvious narrow minded bigot and incredibly rude and insulting to anyone who challenges the "orthodoxy" – in other words a fairly typical doctor. I suppose we are witnessing the system in action right here on this NG, and the effect of billions of dollars of brainwashing on the poor consumers. | Your attitude is interesting. | | Did you know that cancer, and most other diseases, need an acid ph body to live | in? | | How would you test your bodies ph? | | I’ve had terminal cancer for 9 years, and control it by what I eat.  I don’t | use the medical profession. | | You seem very angry at something that you apparently know little or nothing | about. | | Try to open up a little, and enjoy. | | By the way, if there were any punishment for that type of homicide, the AMA | would be in prision, as they kill over 100,000 Americans each year (according | to a report to Congress by Ralph Nader), and more people die with their | "treatment" (as my father did) than without it. | | I don’t use their treatments, and I am doing very well.

That is "why" most doctors become doctors. Their love of people and desire I work in a hospital and see many , many loving caring doctors

Response:

Great to see someone else who is wise to the medical "industry". Both of my parents were also killed by medical incompetence and corruption. RE coral calcium I saw some of that infomercial also, I think the claims are probably exaggerated (though not necessarily) but there is probably quite a bit of validity in them – I don’t know that you have to take that form of calcium, probably a good chelated calcium/magnesium combo would be as good. I’d say almost for sure Barefoot is in it for big bucks but that doesn’t mean he is a liar, once again not many doctors are working for the warm fuzzy feeling of helping people.

Most of that is unsupported assertion.  "Probably exaggerated (though not necessarily)?  How could you possibly make any determination – either way – without any data?  You cast aspersions on doctors for not being in it for warm fuzzy feelings, but are almost sure Barefoot is in it for big bucks?  Without any data, how can you possibly tell whether Barefoot is a liar or not?   You REALLY, REALLY need to read Sagan’s book.  Tell ya what – e-mail me and I’ll mail you my copy!  This is a serious offer, C.  You have got to do something to increase your ability to discern crap from granola.   Of course not many doctors are working for warm fuzzy feelings.  Are you?   Is Barefoot?  They are working to earn a living for themselves and their families.  Warm, fuzzy feelings have very little to do with medicine or any of the sciences.  There is nothing warm and fuzzy about telling a 22 year old, single mother that her new born child has Down’s – as my wife had to do today.  Most of us realize that crap happens – it’s part of the random nature of the universe in which we live.  Down’s is very rare for children born of 22 year old healthy women and out of almost 270 million people in the US, around 13,000 of us – only  .004% of the population – get esophageal cancer.  We live in a random universe and even though the odds are with us, crap still happens.  None of my doctors were warm and fuzzy.. it’s the charlatans who have nothing to offer BUT warm and fuzzy.   One of these days you may learn the difference between warm and fuzzy and caring about people.  With the wife a physician, most of our friends are doctors; the wife is from a medical family and several of her brothers and sisters are in medicine – including one brother who is an oncologist.  Warm and fuzzy?  Not a single one of them, but each of them cares and cares deeply about each patient.  Can they fix all the patients?  Of course not.  Promising to be able to do so would give the patients a nice warm and fuzzy feeling, wouldn’t it?  Promising that if you send in your money and get this wonderful coral calcium that will cure what ails you gives warm fuzzy feelings, but it ain’t true.   Now that I’ve seen what some of my relatives have gone through and how the various drugs affected them, when I see old sick people now I see the effects of drugs they are being induced to take more than old age. It’s very interesting the reverence that someone like "steph" in this newsgroup is held in by users of this group, even though (s)he is an obvious narrow minded bigot and incredibly rude and insulting to anyone who challenges the "orthodoxy" – in other words a fairly typical doctor. I suppose we are witnessing the system in action right here on this NG, and the effect of billions of dollars of brainwashing on the poor consumers.

Steph?  Reverence?  Where?  Steph takes time out of his life to share some of his knowledge with us – us being the cancer patients and their caregivers and not the loons who come on all warm and fuzzy with their iron, calcium or whatever hokum they are selling today.  Most of us appreciate his efforts even if, as in my case, he had nothing to offer me as far as information about my treatments.   You are completely incapable of seeing that your own comments about mainstream medicine make you the same "narrow minded bigot" that you accuse Steph of being.  You wouldn’t know what "challeng[ing] the ‘orthodoxy’" if it came up to bite your ass.  Let me tell you what it isn’t – it isn’t making assertions about treatments without having any data to back these assertions up.  That goes for both conventional and alternative medicine.  You make claims about how damaging mainline medicine is, but offer no data.  You make claims about how superior alternative medicine is, but, again, offer no data.  That’s not challenging the orthodoxy, that’s just being a crackpot.   Orthodox science is being challenged every day, but each challenge is based on observations, data and statistics.  It’s not done based on television info-mercials and warm fuzzy books.   Really, send me your address and I’ll mail you the damned book – FREE! Do the same thing for your mind that you think coral calcium can do for your body.   Eric Unofficial C8 Homepage http://www.ngc1514.com

Response:

Outlook Express isn’t that bad.  I used to use Free Agent, and liked it, however, it does not really do anything to make my life easier, so I make my life easier by using OE which is free. 2nd point….. If the guy can’t handle Outlook Express, Agent will cause him to suffer a major meltdown, although by some of his posts, the meltdown may have already happened. — regards, Michael Abbaticchio

How do you know??? Never mind I know you are not going ot answer since you don’t have an answer, you no nothing about the data at all do you?

Exactly!  I know nothing about the data and that’s why I keep asking you to show it to me.  Since you seem to be aware of the data (how else can you possibly make your decisions and determinations without it?) I am asking for you to point out the web pages that contain it. So… please list the web pages with the data that purports to demonstrate the efficacy of essiac.  Just a few with test results will do.  Once I have the chance to see the data, I can make my own decision whether the data supports your claims or not. I am so happy you are finally getting the point! And, as Steph says, you really need to learn how to effectively use your newsreader software.  I know you are using Outlook Express for your reading chores and that it is an awful program for that.  However, it does allow quoting.  Try Forte Agent.  You have to spend a few bucks for it, but it’s vastly superior to OE. Eric Unofficial C8 Homepage http://www.ngc1514.com

Response:

Duh, and your point is?? They sent clinical data – if it was sent from England it would still be clinical data.

Response:

Duh, and your point is??

My point is that your paochialism is all too prevalent in loonies like you. They sent clinical data – if it was sent from England it would still be clinical data.

They sent noise. Data is something different.

Response:

How do you know??? Never mind I know you are not going ot answer since you don’t have an answer, you no nothing about the data at all do you?

Response:

How do you know??? Never mind I know you are not going ot answer since you don’t have an answer, you no nothing about the data at all do you?

Exactly!  I know nothing about the data and that’s why I keep asking you to show it to me.  Since you seem to be aware of the data (how else can you possibly make your decisions and determinations without it?) I am asking for you to point out the web pages that contain it.   So… please list the web pages with the data that purports to demonstrate the efficacy of essiac.  Just a few with test results will do.  Once I have the chance to see the data, I can make my own decision whether the data supports your claims or not. I am so happy you are finally getting the point!   And, as Steph says, you really need to learn how to effectively use your newsreader software.  I know you are using Outlook Express for your reading chores and that it is an awful program for that.  However, it does allow quoting.  Try Forte Agent.  You have to spend a few bucks for it, but it’s vastly superior to OE. Eric Unofficial C8 Homepage http://www.ngc1514.com

Response:

Attaboy Eric. With three incurable (presently) diseases, I’m well aware that the medics aint perfect. However, with all their faults and preconceptions, they’re way ahead of the holistic, crystal gazing, warm fuzzy new age shills trying to get rich at our expense. I’m not really sure which is worse – the scam artist who knows they’re selling (sometimes lethal) crap or the dupe who honestly believes that eating nothing but seaweed (or whatever) will cure what ails us. At least I can debatewith a scientist based on empirical evidence; debating with a believer is like trying to convert Dubya to Islam. By the way, I’m not whining about my three – compared to most here I’m feeling great.  The (presently) doesn’t mean I might get more but that they might find cures! Cheers – Alan

Response:

I don’t doubt there are many doctors who are very well-meaning – it must be very depressing to see the hopeless performance of the mainstream cancer treatments produced by multi-billion research dollars of taxpayers’ money. Or other well-meaning docs who have developed "alternative" (which just means rejected by the med/pharm industry) systems which are repressed by the establishment – eg Dr Burzinski: http://www.ouralexander.org/burzynski.htm who has a clinic – read the story, and the doctors at American Biologics Hospital in Mexico whose submissions of clinical data are always ignored by the FDA, just to name a couple.

| | | That is "why" most doctors become doctors. Their love of people and desire | | I work in a hospital and see many , many loving caring doctors | |

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I don’t doubt there are many doctors who are very well-meaning – it must be very depressing to see the hopeless performance of the mainstream cancer treatments produced by multi-billion research dollars of taxpayers’ money. Or other well-meaning docs who have developed "alternative" (which just means rejected by the med/pharm industry) systems which are repressed by the establishment – eg Dr Burzinski: http://www.ouralexander.org/burzynski.htm who has a clinic – read the story, and the doctors at American Biologics Hospital in Mexico whose submissions of clinical data are always ignored by the FDA, just to name a couple.

The FDA, son, doesn’t mean squat outside the good ol’ USA Did you know that? Probably not, because you are allergic to facts.

Response:

This afternoon it is pouring down rain so I turned on the TV. There was a show moderated by a person named Kevin Trudeau and his guests name was Bob Barefoot????? who wrote books; one called "The Calcium Factor". He said that cholesterol is not bad because it protects the arteries from acid outside the arteries. He also stated that he could tell by checking the acid in your spit if you were going to get cancer and that the only prevention from it is Coral Calcium. I am so glad that I discovered these newsgroups and read the posts. But is there to protect other people from these whacks. He was very convincing and quoted the AMA and JAMA and universities. If I were not here I would probably forego treatments and take calcium. Is there any way to find out how many people with cancer die following their advice? And is there any punishment for this type of homicide?

Response:

Is there any way to find out how many people with cancer die following their advice?

Not easily And is there any punishment for this type of homicide?

Not in this life

Response:

Your attitude is interesting.   Did you know that cancer, and most other diseases, need an acid ph body to live in? How would you test your bodies ph?   I’ve had terminal cancer for 9 years, and control it by what I eat.  I don’t use the medical profession. You seem very angry at something that you apparently know little or nothing about. Try to open up a little, and enjoy. By the way, if there were any punishment for that type of homicide, the AMA would be in prision, as they kill over 100,000 Americans each year (according to a report to Congress by Ralph Nader), and more people die with their "treatment" (as my father did) than without it. I don’t use their treatments, and I am doing very well.

Response:

Your attitude is interesting.

Yours is pathological…….

Response:

Great to see someone else who is wise to the medical "industry". Both of my parents were also killed by medical incompetence and corruption. RE coral calcium I saw some of that infomercial also, I think the claims are probably exaggerated (though not necessarily) but there is probably quite a bit of validity in them – I don’t know that you have to take that form of calcium, probably a good chelated calcium/magnesium combo would be as good. I’d say almost for sure Barefoot is in it for big bucks but that doesn’t mean he is a liar, once again not many doctors are working for the warm fuzzy feeling of helping people. Now that I’ve seen what some of my relatives have gone through and how the various drugs affected them, when I see old sick people now I see the effects of drugs they are being induced to take more than old age. It’s very interesting the reverence that someone like "steph" in this newsgroup is held in by users of this group, even though (s)he is an obvious narrow minded bigot and incredibly rude and insulting to anyone who challenges the "orthodoxy" – in other words a fairly typical doctor. I suppose we are witnessing the system in action right here on this NG, and the effect of billions of dollars of brainwashing on the poor consumers.

| Your attitude is interesting. | | Did you know that cancer, and most other diseases, need an acid ph body to live | in? | | How would you test your bodies ph? | | I’ve had terminal cancer for 9 years, and control it by what I eat.  I don’t | use the medical profession. | | You seem very angry at something that you apparently know little or nothing | about. | | Try to open up a little, and enjoy. | | By the way, if there were any punishment for that type of homicide, the AMA | would be in prision, as they kill over 100,000 Americans each year (according | to a report to Congress by Ralph Nader), and more people die with their | "treatment" (as my father did) than without it. | | I don’t use their treatments, and I am doing very well.

Response: